Evidence Pertaining to The Origins of Bigfoot/Yowie/Yeti

[Simon M]

Carl Sagan had this to say, and I tend to agree with him. These days it doesn't pay to be credulous.



The Christian Bible also warned against false prophets -

Matthew 24:24 - "For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect".

I doubt politicians, church leaders, celebrities, 'experts', CEO's, journalists, opinionated billionaires, the commentariat, ethicists, sporting 'heroes'...all of them. Anyone who's trying to persuade me to agree with their point of view automatically has me thinking "Why do they want that? What benefit does my agreement or compliance bring them?"

More often than not it's to do with money, and many are blunt about that (advertisers, for example...they're crass but fundamentally honest in their wish to sell you things which you're not obliged to spend money on). Politicians want votes, commentators want an audience, etc, and they all use one another to get what they want (Trump needs the media as much as the media needs Trump). It's the ones who want to 'sell' me an idea or belief system whose intentions I doubt the most.

When people's motives are more esoteric, I become deeply suspicious. Just my opinion, of course.

I haven't seen a Yowie or a ghost. I don't know if they exist. I know for sure, though, that there are con-artists and liars in the world.

I agree with Black that a literal interpretation of the Bible (or any ancient text) isn't really applicable to the study of cryptids. Assuming that one word from thousands of years ago relates directly to something we'd like it to refer to right now just isn't reasonable.

Scholars disagree about what the word Nephilim directly translates as -

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nephilim

Even if it does mean 'giants', it doesn't mean that they were obliquely referring to Yowies. Just my opinion, of course.

[sensesonfire]

The Bible does warn us against false prophets "Wolves in sheep's clothing" as they are described and they have infiltrated the highest echelons of the Christian church but God warns us against these false doctrines by telling us to test the spirits and you shall find the truth.

I have never been one to take my cues from opinions of my fellow mankind no matter how many academic qualifications they have next to their names I have always tested the spirit so to speak. This is where I would be eager to read any theory that the Scientific fraternity might put forward on the existence of these cryptid creatures, I'm open to any suggestions but alas, nothing is forthcoming.
To the majority of scientists, the idea of a monstrous being running amok is just too incredible to contemplate. If it can't be proven then it doesn't exist - no ifs, buts or maybes.

This is when I turn to the greatest book of knowledge ever presented to mankind the Holy Bible for answers and to me, it does not disappoint. Although the Bible does not specifically mention cryptids it does give some convincing clues as to the existence.
Proverbs 25:2 Its the Glory of God to conceal a thing but the honour of kings to search out a matter.

A good clue to cryptids, in my opinion, is when God sent in the Israelites to destroy the land of Canaan. Not only were they to kill the men but also the women, children and animals. Canaan was the land of the Nephilim and the giants where complete wickedness abounded. People of no faith often bring up the argument of how a loving God would demand the death of women, children and even animals. All types of perversion occurred incest, fornication and bestiality. Through the actions of the Rephaim not only immorality and evil existed but God's pure human DNA and bloodline had been corrupted beyond any chance of redemption however not all of the Canaanites were destroyed. Note the bestiality activities of these Nephilim descendants and their ability to create monstrous beings enter the cryptids.



1. The Nephilim were here before and after the Great Flood, in other words, they were not all destroyed.

2. They corrupted everything they came in contact with including the ability to transfigure ( shapeshift) and create monstrous beings causing desolation and despair through the sexual perversions with animals. ( Cryptids-get it)

3. The Bible tells us that 'There are demons traversing the Earth and As in the days of Noah so shall it be with the coming of the Son of man'. In other words, the Nephilim activity will exist right up to present times.

I think is all fairly straightforward as far as I'm concerned but if you are a non-believer then naturally you will not accept these explanations. Maybe the scientific approach is more acceptable to you so I am eagerly awaiting the response.
I am giving everybody a respite as I do not intend repeating myself again.

[Wolf]

Senses, you put together some interesting points and even though I am personally not a Christian I am not arrogant enough to say you are misguided or wrong.

In fact, I would like to invite you to collate your posts into one article so I could publish it with images on my site (if you are interested)... and in this way present a biblical theory to what Sasquatch/Dogman is.

I am currently working on one presenting the 'reasoned science' approach towards what they are in my opinion. An article from yourself would balance mine with a biblical alternative... if you're interested?
You don't have to use your name if you don't want to.

DISCLAIMER: although I used to have a sheepskin jacket years ago I picked up in a Vinnies store, I never wore it...

[Yowie bait]

Yeah i think Senses has some good points too and i can see why you( senses) and other well read Christians would think that but there is no proof they are the fallen Angels or proof they are anything really.

Same goes for the highly evolved cavemen with remarkable abilities theory. Its just all theories and assumption and that is all we have unfortunately.

Would be a good read though Wolf!

[Simon M]

It's impossible for me to take the Biblical stuff seriously (just me being totally honest). People can believe what they want to (freedom of religion, etc), but no one claim that belief and fact are the same thing...they're plainly not.

Beliefs are a matter of choice. We don't choose whether or not the sun rises and sets - it just does, independent of our beliefs. That's the difference. Facts are observable phenomena, beliefs are akin to opinion. Opinions are fine, but they differ. Facts simply are.

It's true to say that most scientists don't believe that Yowies exist. That's not the fault of science as a process, but a fault of human nature.Science is a method of observation not a belief system.

Some devout people want to murder anyone who disagrees with their particular beliefs. That's not the fault of religion as a belief system, but a fault of human nature. Religion is a belief system, not a method of observation.

[Simon M]

I have never been one to take my cues from opinions of my fellow mankind no matter how many academic qualifications they have next to their names I have always tested the spirit so to speak.

So you distrust other people regardless of their qualifications, but you completely and unquestioningly accept the Bible...which was also written by people. The authors all name themselves in the text. Don't try the old "God wrote it" line because it's pure nonsense and we both know you're not silly enough to actually believe it. If you've tested the spirit, good on you, but that's not the same as believing what's written in the Bible. If you've reached your own conclusions via some means other than science, then fair enough.

Please feel free not to repeat yourself for my benefit. I get it. I'll paraphrase - "I'm right and everyone else is wrong and the Bible is correct and science is bad and I will be proven right and you will all be proven wrong because I am right and so is the Bible and science is wrong and so are you unless you agree with me and I know the truth and science does not and I will be proven right because the Bible is correct and I know this to be fact and science is not doing anything about this but the Bible is right and not wrong like science is and did I mention that science is wrong and the Bible isn't because it is right and not wrong"...etc, ad nauseam. Have I understood your basic 'argument'? I mean...that's about it, right?

Yet, oddly, you often usurp scientific arguments in order to make your points. It's mildly amusing sometimes.

If you're going to troll, please make the effort to do so imaginatively.

[sensesonfire]

I have never been one to take my cues from opinions of my fellow mankind no matter how many academic qualifications they have next to their names I have always tested the spirit so to speak.

So you distrust other people regardless of their qualifications, but you completely and unquestioningly accept the Bible...which was also written by people. The authors all name themselves in the text. Don't try the old "God wrote it" line because it's pure nonsense and we both know you're not silly enough to actually believe it. If you've tested the spirit, good on you, but that's not the same as believing what's written in the Bible. If you've reached your own conclusions via some means other than science, then fair enough.

Please feel free not to repeat yourself for my benefit. I get it. I'll paraphrase - "I'm right and everyone else is wrong and the Bible is correct and science is bad and I will be proven right and you will all be proven wrong because I am right and so is the Bible and science is wrong and so are you unless you agree with me and I know the truth and science does not and I will be proven right because the Bible is correct and I know this to be fact and science is not doing anything about this but the Bible is right and not wrong like science is and did I mention that science is wrong and the Bible isn't because it is right and not wrong"...etc, ad nauseam. Have I understood your basic 'argument'? I mean...that's about it, right?

Yet, oddly, you often usurp scientific arguments in order to make your points. It's mildly amusing sometimes.

If you're going to troll, please make the effort to do so imaginatively.

Simon M Scepticism is your forte. I've noticed in your comments you do a lot of in my opinion or that's just my opinion without giving an alternative view. I think the difference between my conclusions and yours although you don't appear to have any is that I'm quite comfortable in what I've discovered about these cryptids whether it's through the Bible or other sources such as the Dead Sea Scrolls. I feel any information derived from the Bible is wasted on non-believers like yourself so I don't feel it necessary to continue with further research on this subject because as I've said I am quite content with my final analysis. So good luck with your scientific endeavours and if you DO come up with any worth while theories I will be eager to read them.

[Simon M]

Here's my point, senseswhatever - you haven't "discovered" ANYTHING. You've read one book - one - and decided it's easier to agree with t than think for yourself. I have opinions because none of us have facts in this area. NONE OF US.

You haven't done 'resarch', mate. You've simply chosen not to use your own brain. That's up to you and if facts are wasted on me, then I'll eave you to your masturbation and not bother with you again.

Just ask yourself this...if you ever require emergency medical help, will you go to a church or a hospital? I bet I know which one you'd choose and it'd be science and not religion. Oh, that evil science that knows nothing!

You've literally just said you don't need to learn anything more. You know everything. Yet you don't feel stupid. It's hilarious.

"I feel any information derived from the Bible is wasted on non-believers like yourself so I don't feel it necessary to continue with further research on this subject because as I've said I am quite content with my final analysis. So good luck with your scientific endeavours and if you DO come up with any worth while theories I will be eager to read them."

You don't have any theories, you have beliefs. Theories are scientific. You say science is 'wrong' yet you speak about theories. You've proven me right with this juvenile bit of nonsense. Well done, you!

[sensesonfire]

Senses, you put together some interesting points and even though I am personally not a Christian I am not arrogant enough to say you are misguided or wrong.

In fact, I would like to invite you to collate your posts into one article so I could publish it with images on my site (if you are interested)... and in this way present a biblical theory to what Sasquatch/Dogman is.

I am currently working on one presenting the 'reasoned science' approach towards what they are in my opinion. An article from yourself would balance mine with a biblical alternative... if you're interested?
You don't have to use your name if you don't want to.

DISCLAIMER: although I used to have a sheepskin jacket years ago I picked up in a Vinnies store, I never wore it...

Hi Wolf, a lot of work involved there Wolf. I know you are a very good writer and able to articulate very well and this is exactly what I am searching for a 'reasoned science' approach to what cryptids are in your opinion. This is a much better option to those who just like to criticise but provide no alternative theory. Good luck, looking forward to that with anticipation.

[sensesonfire]

Here's my point, senseswhatever - you haven't "discovered" ANYTHING. You've read one book - one - and decided it's easier to agree with t than think for yourself. I have opinions because none of us have facts in this area. NONE OF US.

You haven't done 'resarch', mate. You've simply chosen not to use your own brain. That's up to you and if facts are wasted on me, then I'll eave you to your masturbation and not bother with you again.

Just ask yourself this...if you ever require emergency medical help, will you go to a church or a hospital? I bet I know which one you'd choose and it'd be science and not religion. Oh, that evil science that knows nothing!

You've literally just said you don't need to learn anything more. You know everything. Yet you don't feel stupid. It's hilarious.

"I feel any information derived from the Bible is wasted on non-believers like yourself so I don't feel it necessary to continue with further research on this subject because as I've said I am quite content with my final analysis. So good luck with your scientific endeavours and if you DO come up with any worth while theories I will be eager to read them."

You don't have any theories, you have beliefs. Theories are scientific. You say science is 'wrong' yet you speak about theories. You've proven me right with this juvenile bit of nonsense. Well done, you!

You haven't done 'resarch', mate. You've simply chosen not to use your own brain. That's up to you and if facts are wasted on me, then I'll eave you to your masturbation and not bother with you again. I think you mean research. I've underlined your comment in a dark colour because of your rather crude intimations. You have promised me that before and yet here you are. Do try to be a little more laconic with your replies as it saves a lot of tedium.

[Simon M]

Nice attempt at trolling - insult the person and ignore their points, but I had you pegged ages ago and I see right through you buddy.

Your 'theories' are hilariously entertaining - but nothing more - and we both know you don't believe them, either. You don't know anything more than anyone else does, or you'd already have solved everything. You know as little as the rest of us do, but you enjoy talking bollocks online. Fair enough. You're not alone, there.

I'd rather be honest about my lack of knowledge than pretend to know things I do not. Sorry if the facts aren't 'laconic' enough for you.

[sensesonfire]

Nice attempt at trolling - insult the person and ignore their points, but I had you pegged ages ago and I see right through you buddy.

Your 'theories' are hilariously entertaining - but nothing more - and we both know you don't believe them, either. You don't know anything more than anyone else does, or you'd already have solved everything. You know as little as the rest of us do, but you enjoy talking bollocks online. Fair enough. You're not alone, there.

I'd rather be honest about my lack of knowledge than pretend to know things I do not. Sorry if the facts aren't 'laconic' enough for you.

Here you are again. Your attempt at honesty is appreciated.

images (1).jpg

[sensesonfire]

Simon Mwrote:
Just ask yourself this...if you ever require emergency medical help, will you go to a church or a hospital?

To my knowledge most hospitals have chapels although this may be a declining trend in some new hospitals today. Even hospitals cannot separate itself from religion. I have heard of quite a few great surgeons who pray before entering the operating theatre.
Science does have a roll to play but the hand of a skilled surgeon is directed by God whether people believe it or not is irrelevant.

[Simon M]

Yes, and most message boards have sad people like you who stifle debate because they're too busy learning how to troll to actually bother doing it correctly. If you were funny or original, you might be entertaining. Just remember - everyone can read this stuff, and they all see through you. Don't think people cannot see you for what you truly are. EVERYONE knows.

If simply agreeing with me is your version of trolling...you're doing it all wrong. Yes, I don't pretend to know things I don't know...and you do. You've admitted it. That's not actual trolling....unless you're twelve years old and a bit of a slow learner. It's kind of insulting to think you're actually wasting everyone's time with your repetitive and poorly written diatribes. If you were as clever as you think you are you'd be funny. You're just clumsy and have no discernible debating skills. I don't buy this 'religious fanatic' BS for a second and I never have.

https://www.wikihow.com/Be-a-Troll

There you go. You might actually achieve your desired aims if you read that. Then again, given how one-note your writing is....you might not.

[sensesonfire]

Simon Mwrote:
Just ask yourself this...if you ever require emergency medical help, will you go to a church or a hospital?

To my knowledge most hospitals have chapels although this may be a declining trend in some new hospitals today. Even hospitals cannot separate itself from religion. I have heard of quite a few great surgeons who pray before entering the operating theatre.
Science does have a roll to play but the hand of a skilled surgeon is directed by God whether people believe it or not is irrelevant.

role not roll

[sensesonfire]

Yes, and most message boards have sad people like you who stifle debate because they're too busy learning how to troll to actually bother doing it correctly. If you were funny or original, you might be entertaining. Just remember - everyone can read this stuff, and they all see through you. Don't think people cannot see you for what you truly are. EVERYONE knows.

If simply agreeing with me is your version of trolling...you're doing it all wrong. Yes, I don't pretend to know things I don't know...and you do. You've admitted it. That's not actual trolling....unless you're twelve years old and a bit of a slow learner. It's kind of insulting to think you're actually wasting everyone's time with your repetitive and poorly written diatribes. If you were as clever as you think you are you'd be funny. You're just clumsy and have no discernible debating skills. I don't buy this 'religious fanatic' BS for a second and I never have.

https://www.wikihow.com/Be-a-Troll

There you go. You might actually achieve your desired aims if you read that. Then again, given how one-note your writing is....you might not.

Will you please uphold your promise and go away and stop polluting my thread with your endless drivel.

[Searcher]

sensesonfire wrote:

Will you please uphold your promise and go away and stop polluting my thread with your endless drivel.

Awww… I’ve been enjoying this seemingly endless war of words!

Both sides have made relevant points, but there will never be a clear winner.

In the good old days, this shootout might have ended with pistols at fifty paces…

[Tuckeroo]

sensesonfire wrote:

Will you please uphold your promise and go away and stop polluting my thread with your endless drivel.

Awww… I’ve been enjoying this seemingly endless war of words!

Both sides have made relevant points, but there will never be a clear winner.

In the good old days, this shootout might have ended with pistols at fifty paces…

There’s actually a few posts wayback
where they both agreed with each other.

T.

[Simon M]

Will you please uphold your promise and go away and stop polluting my thread with your endless drivel.

Um...no.

Besides, you've been trying to engage me in conversation since I posted this...



Anyone who cares to can all go back and check the thread - you were virtually jumping up and down on the spot trying to get a reaction. It was quite funny, and I'm sure I wasn't the only one having a laugh.

viewtopic.php?f=67&t=5588&p=47695&hilit=ohio#p47695

I enjoy seeing you trying to pretend that you don't love the attention. It's almost endearing. I've yet to see you refute a single point, incidentally. No one else has seen you do it, either.

It's because you're not able to. Which is kind of hilarious, given how much you like pretending to know everything when you plainly have no greater knowledge of the topic than anyone else does. Your ignorance is on display for all to see. It's "I know everything" versus "I do not claim to know everything". Which one makes more sense? I know you know the answer, you just like pretending to be a religious fanatic for attention.

Besides, it's not your thread or your forum. So...there you have it.

I'll let you get back to what you do best - filling the entire forum with useless drivel. You have a gift for it...which, of course, must have been given to you by the divine power of God.

[sensesonfire]

Unfortunately, it's people like yourself Simon M that have seen many good and interesting researchers leave this forum for good or just comment spasmodically it's sad they have disappeared with their extensive knowledge leaving individual morons like yourself to continue on with your odious
B/S. You really do need reporting to the admin board.

[Shazzoir]

Given that this particular Forum Chat Board is called “AYR - Yowie Controversial, Conjecture and Fringe Subject Matter Discussion", I don't see why anything mentioned here should be treated as a sacred cow. It's specifically FOR robust and spirited discussion, and CONTROVERSIAL viewpoints.

But please, casting aspersions on others' beliefs or mocking them, or bagging someone out for not following your line of thought isn't adding to the interesting discussions I enjoy here, and I would hate to see people get so het up they leave because of wounded pride or offence. Not that I don't mind a bit of to-and-fro literal argy-bargy from time to time, but it can be stressful for some.

If any researcher 'left the forum' on the basis of a discussion they read here, that's their call, but it seems to me that would be an illogical reason to do so. What happens in this thread has no bearing on the enjoyment they may gain as a reader or poster on the hundreds of other threads in this forum. 'If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen' comes to mind here, but this is just one thread and nobody posting in it should be judged on it alone, when I have seen wonderfully interesting and informative posts from all of you, in other threads elsewhere on AYR. 'One swallow does not a summer make', since I'm using so many adages right now.

If anyone is offended at reading the words of people they don't know, on a forum thread about esoteric things where beliefs versus facts are spoken of from different viewpoints, then off you go and don't let the door bang you on the butt on your way out. Good grief...

[Simon M]

Unfortunately, it's people like yourself Simon M that have seen many good and interesting researchers leave this forum for good or just comment spasmodically it's sad they have disappeared with their extensive knowledge leaving individual morons like yourself to continue on with your odious
B/S. You really do need reporting to the admin board.

Then do so!

Also, I'd love to see you quote the post with me 'promising' to leave you alone so you don't have to make the effort to defend yourself. Go on and quote it.

As I recall, I said I couldn't be bothered with you because you're an obvious troll, or words to that effect.

Also...it's convenient that you don't have to explain yourself to 'unbelievers'. I guess it makes having an argument so much easier when you don't have to explain what your ideas are. I've yet to see you assert anything. "I know the truth" "I'll be proven right, just wait"....these are not arguments they're statements.

But go on and report me for daring to disagree with you.

[Simon M]

'If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen'

Precisely.

[Simon M]

Also, I am not attacking anyone's beliefs, merely their way of presenting a viewpoint.

Theories are not facts. Opinions are not facts. Beliefs are not facts.

Avoiding saying anything by calling people names is not an adult way of presenting an argument. Saying you know everything - everything - about a given topic and will be proven correct some day without even explaining what you claim to know is pure nonsense, and should be called out as such in my view.

Someone who asserts that they're correct but that they do not have to explain why because anyone who disagrees with them is an 'unbeliever' is trolling, pure and simple.

People can believe what they wish, that's the law; Australia has Freedom of Religion. If you're going to make a statement, then resort to name calling and threats of 'reporting' people when someone disagrees with what you've said, then the heat/kitchen analogy applies.

I've refrained from commenting on this person's posts for some time because I didn't want to give them any more oxygen...but saying you know everything about a topic but don't have to explain yourself is beyond silly. If others want to humour/ignore this person then that's their call, but I'm going to question anyone who makes such an unsupportable claim. Hiding behind 'religion' is a furphy - I'm not questioning religion itself (see my earlier posts), even though I'm not religious. I'm questioning one person's comments and asking for an explanation ('extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof').

If I get banned, so be it. I'd rather be banned for asking an honest question than say nothing and feel like I'm an accomplice to such utter nonsense.

[sensesonfire]

I would like to apologize to my fellow AYH forum members for the debacle this discussion has turned into and a personal apology for being so churlish in responding to such

When I started this thread I did so as a personal endeavour to discover what these enigmatic creatures were and on a subject that appears to have no answers, I believe to my satisfaction I have done just that. As to people believing me or not or to the means I have derived my research is of little consequence.

I see no justification for continuing with any further correspondence on this issue so like some of my fellow paranormal researchers I will be refraining from any further comments. To all forum members trying to find some clarification on these cryptids good luck with that because you are going to need all the help, you can get especially the scientific researchers.

[Simon M]

As to people believing me or not or to the means I have derived my research is of little consequence.

If you've formed an opinion you're happy with, all well and good. If you're going to make a claim, then it must be backed up with evidence. You've provided none. Not one iota.

If that's 'drivel', then I sincerely hope you never have to go to court. Using your "As to people believing me or not or to the means I have derived my research is of little consequence" argument would not go across well with a judge and jury.

Incidentally, that sentence of yours makes no sense grammatically...but I understand your belief that you are above such mundane concerns as facts, evidence, grammar, etc, unlike the rest of us mere unbelievers who are unworthy of your secretly-derived 'knowledge'.

You might have written "As to people believing me or not or to the means by which I have derived my research, that is of little consequence". Yes, I do know what I'm talking about - I have an Honours Degree in English Literature. I didn't need a spirit for that, I just worked hard at it.

Can you name the people whom I've driven form the forum with my comments, or is that another baseless assertion? I'm pretty sure we both know the answer, right?

You say you've 'tested the spirit'...I think you've polished off the entire bottle!

[Simon M]

Incidentally, we all make typo's and I've never picked you (or anyone else) up on those or on spelling, grammar, etc, before. It's because you're so quick to dish out insults but so unable to take them that I mention your grammar. I make mistakes all the time, we all do.

I still maintain that this is a persona you adopt online, and that you're not actually religious. That's an opinion, not a fact. That because I cannot prove it. If you cannot prove something, then it's not a fact.

It's really not that difficult to understand, is it?

[sensesonfire]

I have not been on this forum for three months haven't even opened the Yowiehunters Forum web page. I have found far more interesting Bigfoot and Dogman stories on YouTube than I could ever hope to find on this website. I've discovered that the comments on Youtube more often than not agree with my interpretation of the subject matter. So continue on with your getting nowhere conversations (SimonM) and I will continue to listen to people who have had real hands-on encounters with these creatures and on a far more informative level.