Rocks being thrown......

[Quinkin]

First time commenter, but there's no time like the present I suppose.

There's often reports of items being thrown; rocks, branches and the like, to move people on or scare them away.
I'd be interested to know whether these stones are a regular temperature.
I was shown a book a long time ago which dealt with poltergeist activity, and one story that came to mind was a house that was being hit with stones and rocks of various sizes. At first they thought it was kids, that was until they saw the rocks appearing out of thin air and flying towards the house.
These rocks, when investigated by the local clergyman were both extremely hot, and cold.

I've read that some folk believe the yowie may be able to "zone" in and out of sight, that they are somehow paranormal creatures.

This brings me to another thought.....

The portion of the electromagnetic spectrum which humans can see is an extremely small portion of the whole.
We are good for 380 to 760nm, which , as we all know encompasses what is classed as visible light.

Light in itself is a wave, and the colours we see, are not in fact the colour of the object we look at. A green plant for example absorbs all other colours of visible light and reflects back green. Which is what our eyes see.

What if...... And I'm going out on a limb here, that our hairy friends hair serves more than one purpose. I'm thinking, combined with the low vibrational rumbling or growling that is often associated with the yowie, that the hair absorbs all visible light , thereby making them invisible to the human eye. Now I'm not saying they need to make audible growling to achieve this, but for me it makes more sense than the yowie actually dimension hopping.
If the yowie has in fact gone above the visible light into infrared, a stone being thrown from "there" to visible light would be hot. Longer light waves than red (over 700nm) are invisible, but produce the sensation of heat (black heat)

An ability like this may be why infrared trail cams are not achieving what we want them too. It may stand out like dogs balls to the yowie.

We live on a great planet, with some animals that we know of, that stupefy common sense. The electric eel is one example. Capable of producing enough amps to kill a man.

I've read of yogis, and spiritual men, who have achieved a type of invisibility through vibrational adjustments to their bodies,
just saying, they may not be the only ones capable of it.

[Dion]

Firstly welcome to the Forums Quinkin.

Interesting theories, I like that you not confined to simple thinking, and are willing to step over some boundaries. Good to see.

I agree with some of what you have said particularly the poltergeist stuff, as I have a belief that they may be some form of spiritual entity which would fit in with the rocks/stones coming from thin air, moving from one dimension to another, a dimension they like to stay safe in perhaps?. Touchy subject for most, but there is no evidence for Flesh and Blood either so I think it would be premature not to look at the other side of the coin.

I don’t think anyone has made an effort to stop what they are doing and go and find rocks that are being thrown at them, usually that’s a sign of leave or else. For someone to stop and think about finding the rocks to analyse temperature while being escorted out by one of them would be rather hard to do, unless of course you were willing to cop the possible consequences. But I like where you’re coming from. Having rocks thrown at you doesn’t happen all the time, although it does happen, that maybe because encounters don’t happen every day.

In regards to your light spectrum theory anything is possible.

Anyway keep the thinking coming,

[FM80]

Interesting theory Quinkin. I had a think about it and I don't think it works. If they absorbed all visible light they would become completely black, not invisible.

To become invisible they would need to reflect whatever is behind them to give the impression of not being there, imagine the difficulty of accurately reflecting their background. If they stood still and we moved, they would have to reflect their background as it changes with respect to our viewpoint. If in the bush, they would have to reflect - accurately - the subtle changes in the background - in real time - caused by the wind moving branches, or a bird flying behind them, or insects on leaves.

Touchy subject for most, but there is no evidence for Flesh and Blood either so I think it would be premature not to look at the other side of the coin.

No there may be no solid, scientific evidence as yet, but is it reasonable to suggest that because of this we should entertain the idea of 'supernatural beings'?

Make a list with two columns. Now in the first column list all the supernatural beings that have been proven to exist. In the second column list all the 'flesh and blood' creatures that have been proven to exist - even add all the animals that are extinct but through fossils and DNA have been proven to exist. Pretty one sided list isn't it, couple of million to ZERO.

You could even make another list with animals that were once considered mere myth or legend that have been discovered - in this dimension, reflecting light quite normally. The giant squid, oarfish, mountain gorilla etc.

These two lists speak volumes about this 'supernatural vs F & B debate'. It's so lazy and unnecessary to label the things we don't know as 'supernatural'. Why can't people accept that some things we don't know? Why do we have to categorise things as 'known' and 'supernatural', shouldn't it be 'known' and 'unknown'? It's such a primitive frame of mind to apply the 'supernatural' tag to things as yet unknown, undiscovered or not understood.

Extremely elusive possibly ape-like creature = ooohh, it must be a ghost. Yeah ok, so we should add that to which column in the lists above?

[sapere aude]

What if...... And I'm going out on a limb here, that our hairy friends hair serves more than one purpose. I'm thinking, combined with the low vibrational rumbling or growling that is often associated with the yowie, that the hair absorbs all visible light , thereby making them invisible to the human eye. Now I'm not saying they need to make audible growling to achieve this, but for me it makes more sense than the yowie actually dimension hopping.

Hi Quinkin.

Light is a fascinating thing, there is still a lot we have to learn about it. Such as why it can behave either as a particle or a wave, depending on certain circumstances.

As FM80 has said, absorbing light would make them dark and they would stand out. Though if the light were to somehow bend around them it would make them invisible. This is consistent with known laws of physics and is possible in theory at least. Bending of light (at least to some extent) is known to cause all sorts of optical illusions (gravitational lensing for example). The technology to do this has been around for a while at various wavelengths (such as x-ray/radar). The problem with doing this in the visible light part of the spectrum is that the very small wavelengths involved require the structure of the material to be fabricated on a similarly small scale. There are no known naturally occurring substances that have these properties, but who knows?

An ability like this may be why infrared trail cams are not achieving what we want them too. It may stand out like dogs balls to the yowie.

We live on a great planet, with some animals that we know of, that stupefy common sense.

It was commonly believed that quantum physics was entirely irrelevant to neurology, as the processes were magnitudes of order larger and needed specific conditions (such as near absolute zero temperatures) for certain effects (such as entanglement) to occur for a length of time that what could make them relevant. Yet it is now believed by some scientists that the avian compass/ability of certain migrating birds to know which direction to fly, does in fact rely on entangled electron pairs in the birds eye. Experiments are showing that this happens (for various reasons) at a rate which far supersedes anything scientists can create using optimal conditions in a lab.

The birds are now thought to be able to actually see the earth's magnetic field. Not sure how or why similar abilities to see outside of the visible light spectrum would have evolved in an ape like creature and it sounds doubtful. Yet there is nothing about Yowies that doesn't sound doubtful (in a scientific sense).

[sapere aude]

It's so lazy and unnecessary to label the things we don't know as 'supernatural'. Why can't people accept that some things we don't know? Why do we have to categorise things as 'known' and 'supernatural', shouldn't it be 'known' and 'unknown'? It's such a primitive frame of mind to apply the 'supernatural' tag to things as yet unknown, undiscovered or not understood.

G'day FM80, hope you don't think I'm trolling you . I agree about "known/unknown" which is exactly how I see the so called "supernatural" (something that is not known/understood) or whatever other word people wish to give it. Though I can also see a bit of logical fallacy in some other of your points. That the Yowie is not a normal creature in any biological sense as we understand it, is a certainty IMO. This isn't just based on the fact that there is not, nor has there ever been one physically existent molecule that would indicate they actually exist, as much as based on accounts which directly infer a supernatural element. The subject therefore appears to be a "supernatural" one by definition (beyond scientific understanding at this stage). It's ok to say this line of thinking is errant and Yowies must be normal creatures, but someone will actually need to find a physical Yowie to really be able to show that as being so (which is extremely unlikely to ever happen IMO, for obvious reasons).

I have no idea whether the various ideas put forward by supernatural proponents have any merit. Yet for myself, I can see that there are things/experences beyond our ability to understand.....and while it all sounds way OTT, I can also see where this could be because of my own ignorance. For this reason I am at least open to it. Until there is a reason to believe Yowie physically exist, such speculation will probably continue.

I can see where research from these differing pov's could even be complimentary. As long as specific beliefs aren't being forced on anyone.

[FM80]

Sapere, thanks for the reply, I never consider it trolling, it's all good!!

I see your point, 'supernatural' may just be the word people ascribe to things we don't know yet. But maybe we shouldn't call it 'supernatural' because if these sort of things happen/exist then they must be natural by definition. I thought that anything we see/understand/know must be natural for they happen in nature. Ghosts for example, if they exist, must be natural by definition.

I'm not saying categorically that anyone is wrong or silly to believe that yowies are some sort of spirit/ghost thing and I would never entirely rule out this possibility. It's just the complete lack of evidence for these ghosts/spirit entities versus the massive evidence of F & B animals and history of once thought mythical creatures being discovered that leads me to what I believe to be the most logical conclusion when these factors are considered.

My view is definitely not based on a preconceived idea that science is the be-all and end-all, the only truth, the way and the light, and all that don't believe in science will be forever damned. I don't discount anything simply because it's an unproven, fringe idea leaning towards a supernatural explanation. Not to get too far off topic, but it is the religiously devout who try to make reality conform to their beliefs rather than letting their beliefs conform to reality. When I hear the supernatural side of yowie/bigfoot I don't know why people jump to the supernatural side of the fence when really there is no need to, the knowledge/evidence we have doesn't warrant that kind of thinking yet. There still is so much room left for them to still be real animals which is why I don't get the strange leap to 'supernatural', especially with our track record of finding these once mythical beasts.

I don't know, sometimes it seems that people who have a predilection for ghosts/mysteries/bermuda triangle/god latch on to yowies/bigfoot because yowies seem to be one of these great mysteries. They relish the fact that there is no solid evidence and don't like the fact that science explains things or rationalizes things - perhaps they think that by understanding something, that exciting sense of mystery will disappear and everything will become bland and unexciting. So not true. The truth of how these creatures were so elusive (for so long that some people thought they were ghosts) will be so much more amazing/wonderful/beautiful than any supernatural idea.

[Dion]

Hey FM80

I don’t think anyone is calling them Supernatural or Spiritual just because they are elusive and this could somehow be deemed Lazy.

As Sapere has pointed out it’s the Definition in the words of Supernatural, Spiritual, Paranormal and how those definitions are appropriate to elements in cases and why they are used, which in my opinion should not be ignored.

On that note we should be looking at eye witness reports (many of whom have had odd inexplicable encounters with them, mind you most of whom wish to remain anonymous because of potential labelling of being of odd character) and history of indigenous tribes around the world who, (some not all) believe them to have Spiritual qualities to them.

I would suggest anyone re-read or read if you can get your hands on it “The Yowie In Search of Australia’s Bigfoot” by Paul Cropper and Tony Healy. Namely page 181 which starts with ‘Category X: They are paranormal creatures’, and read to page 195. This comes under the Chapter of ‘Who or What is the Yowie’ the chapter files into four main categories A. The Creatures never existed, B. They are real Flesh and Blood animals, C. They existed once, but no longer do, and they above category X. It may help with why some people believe them to have Spiritual or Paranormal qualities to them by Definition.

[Dion]

Found this image and quote on the net this morning thought it appropriete for this thread.

David Eagleman Quote.jpg

[FM80]

To clarify that post Dion, yes it's common knowledge that what we see is a tiny portion of the EMS but that shouldn't be interpreted as suggesting that an object that reflects or emits light in wavelengths other than the ones we can see is invisible.

I'm sure that's not what you're getting at so I'm not suggesting you believe there are invisible creatures. An object that absorbs all wavelengths visible to humans will be black.

Nice post though, good to visually represent how little is discernible to our eyes.

[FM80]

Forgot to add, when Eagleman says "we're really only seeing a little window of what's happening" he doesn't mean there are things that are invisible. Vegetation for example is green to us, but it reflects much higher amounts of EM energy at near infra-red - infra red wavelengths. So while we only see a green leaf, we don't see the huge amounts of NIR energy streaming off the leaf.

He means we see the visible light, but not the wavelengths invisible to us. He doesn't mean there are things going on totally invisible to us. Visible light has to interact with objects, so we'll either see it as visible light or as a black object radiating heat.

[wellymon]

Who knows what we see and can not see, apparently there are so many dimensions still explorable to this day.

Quote wkikpedia "M Theory"
In 1994, a string theorist named Edward Witten of the Institute for Advanced Study and other important researchers considered that the five different versions of string theory might be describing the same thing seen from different perspectives. They proposed a unifying theory called "M-theory", in which the "M" is not specifically defined, but is generally understood to stand for "membrane". The words "matrix", "master", "mother", "monster", "mystery", "magic" have also been claimed. M-theory brought all of the string theories together. It did this by asserting that strings are really 1-dimensional slices of a 2-dimensional membrane vibrating in 11-dimensional space.

Saying this I have seen things before from being sleep deprived that i have never seen before.

[themanfromglad]

I picked up a rock that had been thrown from out of nowhere once. It had normal temperature. So much for that hypothesis.

[themanfromglad]

First time commenter, but there's no time like the present I suppose.

There's often reports of items being thrown; rocks, branches and the like, to move people on or scare them away.
I'd be interested to know whether these stones are a regular temperature.
I was shown a book a long time ago which dealt with poltergeist activity, and one story that came to mind was a house that was being hit with stones and rocks of various sizes. At first they thought it was kids, that was until they saw the rocks appearing out of thin air and flying towards the house.
These rocks, when investigated by the local clergyman were both extremely hot, and cold.

I've read that some folk believe the yowie may be able to "zone" in and out of sight, that they are somehow paranormal creatures.

This brings me to another thought.....

The portion of the electromagnetic spectrum which humans can see is an extremely small portion of the whole.
We are good for 380 to 760nm, which , as we all know encompasses what is classed as visible light.

Light in itself is a wave, and the colours we see, are not in fact the colour of the object we look at. A green plant for example absorbs all other colours of visible light and reflects back green. Which is what our eyes see.

What if...... And I'm going out on a limb here, that our hairy friends hair serves more than one purpose. I'm thinking, combined with the low vibrational rumbling or growling that is often associated with the yowie, that the hair absorbs all visible light , thereby making them invisible to the human eye. Now I'm not saying they need to make audible growling to achieve this, but for me it makes more sense than the yowie actually dimension hopping.
If the yowie has in fact gone above the visible light into infrared, a stone being thrown from "there" to visible light would be hot. Longer light waves than red (over 700nm) are invisible, but produce the sensation of heat (black heat)

An ability like this may be why infrared trail cams are not achieving what we want them too. It may stand out like dogs balls to the yowie.

We live on a great planet, with some animals that we know of, that stupefy common sense. The electric eel is one example. Capable of producing enough amps to kill a man.

I've read of yogis, and spiritual men, who have achieved a type of invisibility through vibrational adjustments to their bodies,
just saying, they may not be the only ones capable of it.

Trail cams have a battery that runs electronics. Don't be surprised that the electronics can emit sounds that the Bigfoot can hear. Also, don't be surprised that they are watching you telepathically, when you set up those trail cams. Also, try looking at an infrared trail cam through a night vision monocular, when the flash goes off. They can see infrared, I guarantee you. Lastly, don't be surprised that you leave a telepathic trail of your thoughts as you walk down the trail to your camera. They then can read your thoughts well after you have left. Your thoughts will be of trickery. They don't like you to play tricks on them. In conclusion, at best, you are going to only get a far off trail cam photo, unless your camera encounters an untrained juvenile like in the jacob's photos.

[vinderliker65]

Jacob's photo? please elaborate?

[themanfromglad]

Jacob's photo? please elaborate?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbMcZc9sLQc

http://www.bfro.net/avevid/jacobs/jacobs_photos.asp