A possible missing 411 in Victoria?

[micathia]

Russell Hill, 74, and Carol Clay, 73, have been missing since March after setting up camp at Wonnangatta Valley, a six hour drive from Melbourne.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-03-31/ ... d/12105128

https://startsat60.com/media/news/crime ... -new-twist

https://9now.nine.com.au/a-current-affa ... 3e43a41314

[gregvalentine]

Russell Hill, 74, and Carol Clay, 73, have been missing since March after setting up camp at Wonnangatta Valley, a six hour drive from Melbourne.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-03-31/ ... d/12105128

https://startsat60.com/media/news/crime ... -new-twist

https://9now.nine.com.au/a-current-affa ... 3e43a41314

I would think that tragically missing by the actions of a third party or parties of the Homo sapiens species is more likely than the paranormal / aliens or yowies.

[Grantly]

They said the blokes wife had no idea he was with another woman, that's shady for starters. I'm going with the theory of starting a new life together. It'd be interesting to see if they tied up some financials prior.

[sensesonfire]

On the topic of missing 411, without doubt, one of the strangest disappearances in Australia occurred to journalist Joe Hildebrand's younger brother Patrick in 1987. Joe has spoken about it publically and in a book so I'm not speaking out of place.

The incident occurred in 1987, at Victoria's Wilson's Promontory.

Explaining what is every parent's worst nightmare, Joe said members of his family were walking the short four-kilometre trail before Patrick ran up ahead.

'He basically just wandered around a bend and we never saw him again,' he said, before adding, 'It was really surreal and scary.

There were two facts in this case that really interested me but that is not for me to discuss here.

images (2).jpg

[Weirwolfe]

This case has really intrigued me. I feel really sorry for them and their families. It's highly likely they have met with foul play.
The case of Joe's brother screams Missing 411. The second Missing 411 movie is now on YouTube for free. It's called The Hunted. Well worth a watch.

[Austral]

This trail is very thick with vegetation on both sides so it would be impossible to grab a kid and go bush (for a human). I've walked it many times. There was a yowie report where the trail leads to also but at a latter point in time. The kid was also a bit retarded also which tends. to be a common thing with 411 cases.

[sensesonfire]

This trail is very thick with vegetation on both sides so it would be impossible to grab a kid and go bush (for a human). I've walked it many times. There was a yowie report where the trail leads to also but at a latter point in time. The kid was also a bit retarded also which tends. to be a common thing with 411 cases.

Any missing 411 case has to be treated with sensitivity but that is one of the points I noticed that young Patrick was intellectually disabled this case reminds me very much of the abduction of 6-year-old Dennis Martin also intellectually disabled in the Great Smoky Mountains National Park in Tennessee 1969 many years ago but I have read of similar cases.

Another abduction case in Australia where after twelve months the police released some information that astounded me but we just can't talk about it.

[Austral]

[quote=sensesonfire

Another abduction case in Australia where after twelve months the police released some information that astounded me but we just can't talk about it.
[/quote]

Why not sensesonfire ?

[sensesonfire]

[quote=sensesonfire

Another abduction case in Australia where after twelve months the police released some information that astounded me but we just can't talk about it.

Why not sensesonfire ?
[/quote]

Hi Austral, have sent you an email as private messages weren't getting through.

[Grantly]

David Paulides recently did a video on the missing couple in Victoria.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ewlZ9WKKp8

Also an updated news article. https://www.9news.com.au/national/myste ... 4b6c8bdc4f

The detective thinks you can't dig holes with shovels. I don't think he's even tried!

[adventurer]

David Paulides recently did a video on the missing couple in Victoria.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ewlZ9WKKp8

Also an updated news article. https://www.9news.com.au/national/myste ... 4b6c8bdc4f

The detective thinks you can't dig holes with shovels. I don't think he's even tried!

Thanks for the link. Very interesting cases. Ill know where not to go hiking! Thats a lot of missing people in that radius.

[Grantly]

Thanks for the link. Very interesting cases. Ill know where not to go hiking! Thats a lot of missing people in that radius.

It's around where I got yelled at. That whole massive area is beautiful and as Dean pointed out in a recent video, the amount of people up there is pretty small compared to other parts of the country. A mate of mine who laughs at the Yowie thing went for a 35k hiking camping trek with his missus a couple of months ago and admitted he got woken by a huge scream. I haven't pushed for details but I can tell he doesn't really want to know what it was.

As far as the old couple goes, the burnt out campsite makes me think they got messed with. There's some proper hillbillies all over our country if you go deep enough.

[Ron Smith]

After listening to this podcast

https://www.abc.net.au/radionational/pr ... r/13215436

I'm of the opinion that a serial killer or rouge shooters played a part in this disappearance, the podcast from background briefing on RN looks at 9 mysterious disappearances that have occurred in the Wanangatta NP.

When I listened to the podcast it scared the hell out of me.

[rowbe]

I'm with you Ron, I also believe there is a serial killer of sorts hunting in that area. Although I think the case of of Russel Hill and Carol Clay may not have been. Considering the camp site, too many clues (for lack of a better word, albeit limited) were left and I think the drone has played a part in this scenario - just looks sloppy. Like your suggestion of rouge hunter(s) (maybe the couple saw something when using the drone) plus don't forget the "button man". Thanks for link to podcast, will listen.

[Ron Smith]

plus don't forget the "button man".

I agree rowbe, Button Man is a strange figure, although, the police have apparently interviewed him either late last year or early this year, But I wouldn't go out camping in the middle of nowhere like he does with just a hammock and animal skins to keep himself warm which is apparently what he used to do, he used to camp out for months at a time. You should find the podcast interesting anyways.

cheers

[gregvalentine]

I'm with you Ron, I also believe there is a serial killer of sorts hunting in that area. Although I think the case of of Russel Hill and Carol Clay may not have been. Considering the camp site, too many clues (for lack of a better word, albeit limited) were left and I think the drone has played a part in this scenario - just looks sloppy. Like your suggestion of rouge hunter(s) (maybe the couple saw something when using the drone) plus don't forget the "button man". Thanks for link to podcast, will listen.

I'm assuming that you both mean 'ROGUE hunters' . . .

[rowbe]

I'm assuming that you both mean 'ROGUE hunters' . . .

Greg, you didn't like the idea of hunters wandering the bush with makeup on such as rouge? Yes, meant "rogue".

Thanks Ron for the podcast link, just listened to it and received some info I had not heard before - I have looked at these and other close area missing persons previously on a couple of occasions.

When I first looked at these cases, I was thinking of the "possibility" of a yowie abducting the "missing persons". From previous sightings/abductions, etc thought to involve yowies there are some common features - food in area (blackberries), inclement weather rainfall, dense vegetation, remote, person alone, no sign of clothing in area. However, when you dig deeper it is more likely to be missing persons due to human intervention. In relation to the hunter, etc I find it hard to believe a yowie would also take the hunters rifle as well as his equipment.

Interesting, it was mentioned in the podcast of gunfire at the relative same time when the persons went missing (not all cases). Rapid gunfire. The finding of 30 cal and .243 calibre rifle casings. Now there are not many types of rifles that fire a 30 cal, one being an M1 carbine used mainly in WW2 and Korean war. It was a short semi automatic rifle...it used to come with a 10-15 shot magazine but you can buy 30 magazines, buy 2, tape together and you have 60 shots before you need to reload...I used to have one many years ago for hunting...not good for distance but great in close quarters (e.g., in vegetation) and will bring down a wild boar. I believe you can also get semi-auto .243 calibre rifles...Remington and Winchester, I believe, previously made rifles using the .243 calibre.

Marijuana plantations - have come across these myself, usually from a distance (mainly Central Queensland). I do know sometimes these crops are booby-trapped and also may have a guard(s) nearby. If someone walks across one, may explain why the disappearance and missing equipment, etc. Also, could Russel Hill have found a plantation using his drone? Did Warren Meyer stumble across a manned plantation?

It would be so easy for a serial killer to use the area as his/her hunting grounds. Remote, not too many people around, alone bush walkers, places to hide and watch and wait, many places to hide a body . The two unprovoked shooting of two people (1 man and 1 woman - different times) who survived, one which stated a guy got out of his car and shot him 3 times - would not say this was a coincident.

I'm still not convinced that the button man knows nothing about the disappearances. For someone who has been sighted in many places in the area and is said to watch creep up on hunters etc. Even if he is innocent in relation to killing these people, I do believe he knows more (even if he has already spoken to Police). Maybe he has and the Police are following leads. What is also surprising is that the button man has seemingly moved on from that area. I guess would be interesting to see if missing persons continue in that area in the future.

I've only been in the area once and was in the Gaffneys Creek area. Now knowing SOME of the people, their sometimes illegal activity, the guns they keep, some off the grid for a reason, maybe instances of mental/psychological issues, ... I can understand how certain things could happen. It is a wild area, dark and gloomy at times and easy to get yourself lost, if you want to.

However, the missing persons could also have been due to medical issues, getting lost, falling and injuring/killing themselves, or faking the disappearance. Again thanks Ron for the podcast link, let me know if you see anything similar. Does anyone know of similar multiple missing persons account s in the Victorian area, or anywhere else for that matter?

[Ron Smith]

Hi rowbe, Sounds like you enjoyed the podcast as much as I have.

You have written a fantastic recap of the information from this podcast Which Ashlynne McGhee of ABC I'm sure would agree, Which raises the question of, If you're investigating these disappearances yourself, Would it be worth your effort to contact Ashlynne McGhee to try and obtain a copy of her notes for this?


Anyway I agree with all you have written, Some of the disappearances are from human intervention IE: drug crop discovery, or video evidence taken by the drone or human misadventure.

The most chilling incident in my mind was the guy riding his bike on the Beechworth to Murtlyeford rail trail, That is simply cold and calculated, The shooter t to do damage and for a person to be shot 3 times, twice in the body and one in head to survive is remarkable, That incident could have something to do with the escaped psychiatric patient.

The biggest disappointment I found is that it appears Victoria Police have not done nowhere near a thorough investigations into these incidents, The most telling was the family whose property backed onto to the NP where they heard multiple shooting of high powered semi auto rifles over two consecutive days and the police didn't attend.

anyway, I hope there is more info to come out.

[FNQ yowie]

They caught the guy who murdered these two oldies.
He was a jetstar pilot too. Rumour i heatd was he flipped out when he showed up to what he felt was "his" private isolated camping spot, and shot them.